Ok. Didn't want to get into it but I just have to reply. I know it's pointless, and not good for me (or probably you) but anyway. Will just have to 'act in haste and repent at leisure' or whatever the saying is.
I refered to D as you give the impression that it was just me that thought the house used to be messy, and that even if it was then so what.
It sounds as if your friendship with D is a world away from that of a few months ago when you said you found it difficult to talk with her as you felt she was being 'indirectly critical of you in some way.
Yes i did mention my mum,but then said for obvious reasons wont use her as an example. I was looking to use someone that you would feel comfortable with to say 'look its not just me that likes to live in a tidy house, 'normal' people like it also'.
Your workload; as far as stuff round the house i would agree that you did lions share, i would not question that at all. and you must be happy that the small increase in workload has meant the house is nice and tidy now. Little dig there? I haven't had a small increase in workload. I have had a large decrease in workload which is why the house is nice and tidy now. Because you are not here being another person creating mess and I now have a bit of time each week without the children to potter around and do housework.
The quotes from the book you used i understand and recognise in me. I struggle with the concept 'he doesnt believe that you should set any limits on his conduct or insist he meet his responsibilities' Is that not the conditioning that you as the woman are trying to escape? I understand that part as the man has should have no control over you (which i agree with) but the woman can have control over the man because we will substitute the word control with limits his conduct, and who is setting these responsiblities, you, me, lundy, society. that part to me seems like double standards, i dont get it.Well I hope that you do get it during the programme, because you are misunderstanding this bit. Deliberately or not, I don't know.
I enjoy knowing that it is ok to go out and be tired/hungover the next day without being judged as a bad father.I am glad that you can enjoy this now. Of course, let's ignore the fact that I rarely ever went out or had any time to myself. Maybe I was a little irate about that. Especially as if I did ever do something for myself then I got hauled over the coals for it (I can only use the writing course as an example because there has barely been anything else over the last 5 years).
that if i have to work late on a job i have not failed as a husband.Ok. I am sure I have never said or implied that you have failed as a husband. You have. But I have never before said it, and not for this reason.
that if i spend money on tennis i have not taken it away from the family.
Yesterday when you called and i was at M's i had a worried feeling that i was out late doing something i shouldnt, i am sure that will pass with time. I expect you will deny you ever treated me like that, maybe over the past few years, but over a decade of being made to feel guilty for going out kind of gets ingrained into you.
I know that in the sexist world we live combined with my physical abusiveness and ongoing emotional abuse you have suffered more than me, but you have given me some crap as well.REACTING TO YOU.
I know I probably seem angry and irrational here A*****. But I just can't believe you are still living so firmly in this justified, entitled world you have built around you. Has nothing made any impact at all? Nothing? You are so firmly in denial it is scary.
I think it's going to be a long while before we can actually discuss any part of our relationship. We are still poles apart. Poles apart. Let's carry on as we have been for the last few weeks while you attend the programme, and I carry on with what I'm doing. I'd say it will be another couple of months or more before we might be ready to discuss this stuff properly. I don't know what you think.
I just would like to add:Although I know this was probably pointless. Actually, I feel a whole load better having said it.